Midweek Mention... Vice

Vice

Dan: Lost

Boys

cris: about Gilmore Girls? This is

Dan: it's stuff that nobody's ever watched

Sidey: Adrian Brody, I remember him.

cris: Yeah,

Adrian Breaux is,

Sidey: he's in the OC, remember that? He's in

Dan: Edward

Reegs: in the Brutalist as well, right? The, just one of

cris: won some BAFTA

Reegs: Yeah, the BAFTA's gonna win everything. I just started watching What was

the

Sidey: nominated thing at the Golden

cris: honestly, I was gonna cry

Reegs: What is it? Emilia

Sidey: that. Emilia

cris: Perez,

Sidey: 11 nominations.

Reegs: All I see is that like 15 second clip of that guy singing about, I'm gonna get my penis cut off. Honestly,

cris: it's truly shocking. I don't know why they got any awards. First of all, they put like an award for whatever in the picture. I've seen something on my Instagram feed this morning. And the first picture is the Selena Gomez one. I'm like, if you would have seen how she acted and how she sings and how she sounds, you would run away.

Dan: That dude

Reegs: Who is that? Let's have a look.

Dan: him

Reegs: Edward Herman. Oh, yes. Yeah.

Dan: he's the only

kind of person I recognized

Sidey: Right,

Dan: Instantly.

Sidey: That segues very

Dan: That's why we do it

Sidey: Into the midweeker we watched which was Vice.

Dan: Yeah

Vice vice baby

Sidey: 2018, yeah it is. 2018. It is indeed. And it is a biopic about Dick. Yeah,

cris: But Dick Cheney.

Sidey: didn't know that it was gonna be that. I thought it was going to be because we'd watched we'll get into that in the next episode, kneecap.

And that was like quite a lot of pharmaceuticals in that I thought this was gonna be about vice in that, going in that direction. So when I called it up and it had a picture and I was like, oh, where is this going? Because there were other vices as

cris: Yes. Yeah.

Sidey: I better make sure I'm watching the right one here.

So yeah, it, it surprised me. The subject matter.

Yeah. It, it basically like, just get into it from get go. It's like definitely a companion piece to the big short 'cause it's the same people, the same cast, the same production, like director

Dan: Yeah,

Sidey: Same

Dan: exactly.

Sidey: the aesthetic, everything is sim is

Dan: It is, yeah, it is very similar to that. I guess they had a winning formula with that and they wanted to recreate the same and this story of Dick Cheney, who just seems to fly under the radar if you're not really, you know, if you're just looking at the headline, who's president, then it's George W.

Bush, but

Sidey: it starts

Dan: man behind

Sidey: saying that this is like super secretive guy, you know, there's not like he hasn't got a memoir or anything like that out there.

So they're like, you know, we've done, they say, it literally says we've done our fucking best. So, There's probably going to be like, fairly liberal amounts of artistic license,

Could be.

1. And it starts off with him in his hometown, drink driving.

Dan: Yeah. Yeah.

Which, he should lads, lads, lads, isn't he? He's, he's

Sidey: he's Described as a ne'er do well.

Bit of a fuckwit, sort of just a bit of a grifter. Not grifter, like a labourer. And just getting pissed up and fighting bar fights and stuff like

Dan: Yeah, not really going

cris: off and fighting bar fights and stuff like that.

Yeah, not really going anywhere. pizza boxes and vomit everywhere and bottles of alcohol.

Dan: the man cave on a Monday. Yeah.

cris: And it kind of goes through a little bit of how he actually was until he has a when he gets the DUI, no. When did the police kind of, he gets out of the car and he falls on his knees.

Sidey: He's absolutely all over the place and we don't find out what happens to him per se But we do get like I think he gets delivered home and his wife like gives him a fucking right bollocking because it's the second time.

I know she's had to go and pick him up from the station. It's the second time, you know, you're gives him, reads him the right act. And essentially, like you say, while he's the, the guy behind the president or pulling the strings behind the scenes, she's like fucking like

a puppet, you know,

cris: she's like fucking working him, like a puppet, you know.

Dan: Yeah Yeah,

she's a piece of work.

He's a piece of work as we learn to

cris: of it

Dan: we as we go on but he isn't as dumb as He was originally acting. He's he's with her behind her him and Kind of pushing him forward And that threat of her walking out he suddenly starts to climb the, the kind of political spectrum,

Sidey: Yeah. We gets, he gets to work in the White House during,

cris: becomes an intern for

Sidey: under Nixon's

cris: for

Sidey: And works for Rummy. Yeah. And just kind of aligns himself with him. He can see that this guy's like got

what it

Dan: him, you can see that this guy's like, got what it

Sidey: Until he goes full

Dan: Dick

Sidey: Full dick.

Dan: Yeah. But between the two of them, they found kind of kindred spirits, haven't they? They're prepared to just wallow in the power rather than actual, actually thinking about the humanity

cris: Well, that's what, that's what I was, because I, I kind of, the biggest thing I knew about Dick Cheney was that he shot someone in the face and the guy survived.

Dan: And then got him to

cris: Yeah.

Dan: for fuck's

cris: Well, anyway, so, so I didn't know much about, and I knew he's the vice president and all, but then when I've seen that, I was like, so this guy didn't actually care

Sidey: No, it's, this is not, this is not about, you know, for the greater good. And

cris: it's like, how do I get to

Sidey: trip and it's, it's about control and power. And you know, I was aware of all this stuff, but just as a American government, you know, I'm doing air quotes, not that.

There are specific people who are thinking this stuff up and fucking making it happen. Horrible, horrible

Dan: I mean that, that's it. And they understand who those people are and want to aspire to be those people. As Steve Carell is, is you know, he's, is Rumsfeld. He, he understands which which chords to pull really of

cris: Yeah, well, they have that conversation. It's like, ah, who is in that room? Are you seeing that room? There's Nixon and someone else. Why are they not in the Oval Office? because he doesn't want that thing to be recorded. Therefore, we're going to invade Vietnam.

Dan: Yeah, Cambodia and shit like

cris: or Cambodia,

Dan: and they're talking about saying look behind that room there, people are making decisions that means 10, 000 people are going to be carpet bombed.

That's the power, you know, not like, what the fuck, we should stop it. Or shouldn't we have a word? It's like, can you feel it? And they're just, you can see they're getting excited by just having that power just behind that

Sidey: because the the the funny thing is that he's so drab yeah and he gets a chance to kind of do some lectioneering himself and he goes up on stage in front of his hometown and he's pathetic like he just cannot like rally the troops his wife's there just like embarrassed by it like

cris: Yeah, it's like I, either I get a drink or he gets a drink because this is not

Sidey: and in the end Because he has constant heart trouble and the first time he's laid low with heart trouble, she goes out and does the campaigning and she's fucking way better

than

Dan: the campaigning, and it's fucking way better than him.

The story is kind of non linear as well, because it starts off in a drink driving,

we're

Sidey: is kind of non linear as well because it starts off with him drink driving and then we're immediately on 9 11.

I can't remember what happened on that day some other stuff But they're in the like the war room and everyone's sort of panicking and taking calls Don't know what to do and it's like there was one guy in the room who sensed an opportunity And then it cuts away and later on it cuts back to him and he gets his lawyer over and he's like Sort of manipulating his situation to further his own like agenda

Dan: Abso Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. He's where everybody else see.

Disaster and and death he's

Sidey: Yeah, they're on the phone

Dan: rubbing his hands together going. Fuck. You know, we

Sidey: Because he's got this thing we'll have to edit edit edit because he's got this it's like donald trump's done where anything you do as president is is fine because you're president. President and there's a term for it in the film.

cris: Yeah, the, yeah, I can't remember how. It's

Sidey: like unilateral blah, blah, blah,

cris: Yes, yeah,

Sidey: makes you, anything you do is legal and the president

cris: of something.

Sidey: And it's at that moment where he's able to get that across the line with his fucking dodgy lawyer bloke. 'cause he just says, any planes in the air shoot 'em down and like, is that presidential authority?

And he's like,

Dan: yeah.

cris: And there's that Condoleezza Rice, she's like, Should we not inform Poulter's? No.

okay

Dan: what he's, what he's agreed because George W. Bush Jr, when he comes up for election, he understands that he needs somebody other than him because he's dumb as shit or somebody else realized probably his dad

Sidey: The whole party.

Dan: the whole party realizes he's a great, he's got the name, he's got the Bush name, but he's a bit of a wild one himself.

Sidey: Yeah, they show him at a party pissed and he just can't behave himself. He's

Reegs: Hey, he's playing Bush.

Sidey: Rockwell

Dan: him,

cris: he actually plays him really well, because I was watching it with Keira, and she, she doesn't, she didn't really follow the movie necessarily, and she kind of looks, she's like, is that meant to be George W.

Bush? He kind of looks like him.

Dan: Yeah. Yeah. He, it is, it's a really great performance and there's lots of great performances. I mean, Christian Bale is, is

cris: he gets fatter and fatter,

Dan: Dick Cheney.

Sidey: a fat suit, is it? He put

just,

he said

Dan: he, he's, he's probably gone from the machinist to fucking

Sidey: said it was a dark of pie to get him that big.

Yeah, it's unbelievable. But he, so that, so he's gone like interns and whatever, then he starts getting proper jobs. So he goes Chief of staff. Secretary for Defense and then he gets the VP and then they lose the election and he has to come back and George Bush Jr.

Dan: Yeah.

Sidey: Phones

him and his missus says we're not going to take that job are you? You've always said the vice president's like shit job, you're

Dan: says we're

Sidey: he gets Bush to

agree.

Dan: that job away, you've already said the vice president's a shit job, you can't do that. He gets Bush to agree.

You know, bureaucracy things. You go on instinct, really, don't you? He goes, Yeah, I'm that kind of guy. He goes, I can see that in you. I'll take things like, you know, bureaucracy, like

cris: The military.

Dan: energy, foreign affairs.

Sidey: the executive authority from the

Dan: And he goes, and it leave you just to kind of, you know, go. And he's, yeah, yeah, I think I can do that.

So. Basically, the entire authority of the presidency is handed over to Dick Cheney.

Reegs: Well, it's the same with all the oil companies

Sidey: Yeah, so there's all

cris: how it spins off that.

Sidey: when they start getting into strife a little bit because it's Halliburton. It's him and

Dan: Yeah.

Sidey: And they've just had like, Just free contract, just contracts where they just name their price and they're just getting it. And then they're like, well, okay, so they manipulate the war on terror.

It's all spin. as we all know, but this is just seeing the guys actually fucking create it's twisted.

Reegs: and there's this

Sidey: one guy, there's one sort of small guy who was obviously like a problem because he's a terrorist, but it's like a tiny little. You know a couple of people and they spin that out to be the

the that's how they're

cris: because that guy was in Iraq because they invaded Afghanistan because that's where Osama was Bin Laden, but they didn't have a reason to invade Iraq, but it shows in the movie how they made a plan with all these big oil companies where they would want to buy the fields and which field in Iraq while Saddam was still there.

Sidey: did then the movie You Because the material whilst it's like horrifying and appalling it it's fairly like dry and if you were to just present it like that so they they'll use sort of tricks and gimmicks and one of the bits they go to a restaurant and the the servers like going through the specials and he's like oh we've got a Guantanamo Bay and he'll go through and explain like all about that and all these other like horrendous things and one of them is the just being able to pick people off off the street on in foreign soil.

And they're like, Yeah, okay, we'll have one of everything. And then they see, you know, there's one bit where he's just going through Intel and they're like, Oh, there's this guy.

He's suspected other and he's like, Okay, pick him up. And then it just cuts to them just rock like taking off the street, like duct taping over his whole face and stripping him naked and like torturing him.

It's fucking awful. And he's just in his chair just like just It ain't no thing. It's a fucking piece of shit.

Dan: Yeah, yeah, it's just, it all cuts down to, you know, people in offices, and, and shuffling paper.

cris: And one of the best scenes that I found in this movie was when. Finally, they go through to the election. Finally Bush gets elected. Al Gore, who he was candidating against, or he was running against, tries to make the Florida votes to be recounted.

And Dick Cheney is like, right, we act like we won. He's like, yeah, but he's gonna do this and try to recount. No, we act like we won. And let's see who do we put in, in, places and you see how they make, obviously, I don't know if this meeting happened. This is more how the movie is played, but they're in a room, him, Rumsfeld, his lawyer, the guy that sits always stands up, the guy with the big eyes.

I can't remember his name. He's a good actor as well. You know who I mean, though? I can't

Sidey: the Brit

Eddie

Reegs: ime. Oh.

cris: No, there's another one, like a young one with, with a big eyes. I can't, anyway, anyway, one of them. And he kind of goes right in the Oval Office in like in and around the president is going to be Cheney as vice president is going to be his lawyer and Rumsfeld to do the Pentagon. And the president will have.

Two people out of the whole group. And they show a picture of like the oval office and faces like the FIFA cards, you know, it kind of looked like FIFA cards in, in, in, in and around the office. Like the, the actual desk is like, well, these are pawns. This is pawn we're controlling this. And then, okay. So what about the CIA?

Okay. We're going to need that. What about the Pentagon? Well, we're going to have you and you need to get, and all in all, we're going to have around 500 people in different offices, in different places that we can all.

Sidey: And you see him do all this like fucking awful stuff and all the repercussions are, you know, magnified and terrible.

And then you get you get a shot of is a family man, right? And so you see his daughter. We don't know. It's his daughter initially. She it's just a girl leaving a building crying. She gets in a car. She's bleeding. drives off and there's a collision next thing like she's in hospital there there it's there it's the daughter and the mum's like you know why if you know what happened why did you have to run off like that she said oh i broke up with my girlfriend and that's the first time she's Just come out to them and you think, oh, and you can see like, she's fucking like the

cris: She

Sidey: She and me, she, she didn't speak first, but he put his hand and I said, that's fine. You know, it's, that's absolutely fine. If you love someone, that's fine. You think, well, fucking at least he's like got one redeeming characteristic. And his mom goes, well, this is going to be fucking really problematic for like, you know, campaigning stuff.

And then, and then the like, what do you think he couldn't be any more of a at the end. So he's got two daughters. And when he's, so he has a hard job, he has a bypass and a full transport actually, but he can't like carry on anymore. He just has to rest up. So he's going to like, like live this through his, the straight daughter.

Reegs: Mhm.

Sidey: And so the person that she's campaigning against puts all this stuff out about she supports gay marriage and you know She's like eroding christian values and all this sort of shit and she's like crying to dick chain again Oh, I don't know what to do What should we do about it? and he just he's like, you know, like a don't worry sort of thing and then it cuts to her on a Panel on a fucking chat show like a fox news And they're like i'll say, you know, Things being said about you about supporting gay marriage.

She goes, no, I absolutely do not support gay marriage. And then you just see her sister, like absolutely crestfallen on the phone. Like

she would only have done that if you fucking said it's okay. And you're like, you fucking just shut up. You're like, you horrible, horrible bastard. Like the one redeeming feature you had

cris: gone.

Sidey: end. I

cris: Thing that we haven't said yet is half or, or throughout the whole movie, the narrator is the blonde ginger guy who

Sidey: is a, is a Marine, isn't he?

cris: yeah, he's a, he's a Marine, but he also turns out to be,

Sidey: Jesse Clemens.

Dan: heart

cris: Plemons, who, who he's the donor because he died in

Sidey: He's a

Reegs: So what's the metaphor?

They had to give him a heart because he didn't have one. Basically, that's kind of like,

Sidey: out and it is all black. And you're like, okay. It's a heavy handed kind of metaphor, but yeah, I get it.

Dan: I mean, there's this other bit where it depict the, the sh the accidental shooting of a guy called Harry, Harry

cris: Westinghouse.

Sidey: It's actually

Dan: funny. And they're all, you've probably heard of it, where Dick Cheney shot

cris: In the face.

Dan: in the face, in the face on a, on a shoot, on a hunting thing, and then the guy who got shot in the face is kind of apologizing for having his face there. You know?

Reegs: I mean, we lived through all of this. I mean, I do remember, you know, Rumsfeld and Cheney as these, like, right wing hawks in in America, just warmongering and profiteering. I do remember

Sidey: I just wasn't aware of the detail, like how, like, fucking manipulative and

cris: And how they had the act of because of them there were all these acts and the amendments to the to the are they can spy on their own people and they can check emails, telephones all

Sidey: still there

cris: All is still there all because of what he him and his lawyer constructed and also what they were saying about the the Trump thing now is like in the president in power because in 2018 Trump was in power as well.

It's like the president. It applies this interpretation of the. Legislation act or whatever is called that thing is like this applies to this day because it's an interpretation of the way the law is so if you're the president and you make a decision you're above the law

Reegs: Yeah, well, we've already seen insurrection and all manners of shenanigans there.

So

cris: which is fucking mental

Reegs: Yeah.

Dan: Which is fucking mental. He's able to justify it to himself by, in his mind, keeping

Sidey: Mind keeping american people safe for the safe from what i'm not entirely sure but that's how he justifies it

Dan: Yeah, yeah, it's

cris: it's um Well, it a couple of

times,

Dan: Well, I've seen it a couple of times this movie and I really enjoy it. I love the the act and I love the the the the story of it and the fun that it kind of pokes through this very complex and serious kind of guy the fact that it highlights these people who effectively haven't been elected, you know, yet are making all the decisions in behind and, and how the system is set up to support that or at least allow it to be manipulated.

And when you've got people like Dick Cheney and Rumsfeld who you know, You know, a cackling, certainly in this, you know, around the things that they can get away with and do and rubbing their hands together with all their you know, oil friends and, and others, then it makes you kind of mad and feel cheated and conned.

And I know it's just a movie and, and they do say right at the beginning. You know, we're making we're doing the best we can with the limited information that we've got But you kind of get the sense that they're not far off.

Sidey: No, and all these things like the oil, that's absolutely like, without doubt. Yeah,

Dan: I mean christian bale, I think he won an award for this I

Sidey: thanks to Satan for giving me the inspiration.

Dan: inspiration, and yeah, which you know just goes to show how Dark this guy's heart really was

Sidey: What do you think, Chris?

cris: I never seen this before the only thing I related it with because obviously because of the political

Sidey: yeah

cris: side of it to kind of tie it into the political side of the movie that we review for the main of the week.

But I've always wanted to watch it. And I kind of knew that is the, it's a biography because generally in, in whenever you, it used to be on Netflix and now it's on Amazon prime and in on Netflix, it shows you is like biography or drama or whatever on the genre and And I knew it was a story about someone that I, because I've heard that he shot someone in the face and I was surprised that guy lived, but apparently he shot him with buckshot.

It

Sidey: Yeah, he's kind of sat in his sitting down, isn't he?

And he just accidentally goes off and sprays the guy

cris: Anyway, so, so I kind of knew roughly that he was the most notorious vice president and all that stuff. And when I've seen the cast, I was like, this has to be something that I have to watch, even if it's because we've seen movies with a stellar cast and not necessarily, I wouldn't say stellar in terms of, oh my God, they're all on, but they're all good, solid, you know,

Dan: I mean, Christian

cris: Christian Bale, Amy Adams,

Dan: transformation. I mean, he literally has. Just transformed into

cris: a pie man according to

Dan: I mean the mannerisms and even sam rockwell

cris: oh yeah he's they're all

Sidey: got a prosthetic nose and a thing in his to push his lip out a bit he's really good in it

Reegs: Adam McKay, isn't it, that

Sidey: he had a heart attack during it and because No, adam mckay the director and because bail had done, you know, he gets really into it He'd done so much research and learning about Chaney's heart condition and all that.

He was, they were able to like save Adam McKay because they knew so much about his heart condition or whatever.

Reegs: bail did the surgery himself

Sidey: went full method. Yeah, I

cris: He was good though, with, he kept doing this with his mouth, like, He

Sidey: studied him. Yeah, he studied all his mannerisms and

cris: that's like, you know, it's one of them that he thinks, you

Dan: I thought you were going to say he, he just went straight into the couch.

He just didn't give a fuck. He was just like, Oh, I'm okay. He's

Reegs: He's got like a facial tick like gordon brown or

Sidey: I thought the film was was, was good. Like. Like really well made that they make it engaging and stuff with the tricks and things that they do with it I just found it so fucking depressing It's just so bleak that and it's still carrying on probably getting worse

Dan: made me more angry when I, you know, rather than, you know, it's what you want. Films do you want them to, to, to make you feel something and the injustice of it. And, and the fact that as you say, rigs, it happened on our watches in, we were alive

Reegs: we were younger, but

Dan: We didn't have much influence over the American election at the

Reegs: No, it's not as much.

No,

Dan: but just, You wanna shake people and say, wait the fuck up.

History repeating itself in, in

cris: Yeah, also he won by 553 votes. That was, that was, that's a fact. That's not, they didn't make that up in the movie.

Dan: that's not

cris: So for America, like the United States of America,

Reegs: Decided on 500 votes.

cris: be decided on 553 votes.

Sidey: that,

Reegs: Yeah.

cris: that yeah, is that is that what kind of difference is that?

Dan: you. Yeah I, I think that their family didn't you know, love the film afterwards.

The Chaney family.

Reegs: What a surprise.

Dan: yeah, but

Sidey: and it all

Dan: No, and all just collateral damage in, in the Cheney, bandwagon. But I like the movie. I wouldn't rule out watching it again.

Sidey: Just to

Dan: just to anger myself and go, what the fuck is going on again? But I

cris: I didn't, I wasn't angry, it's the first time I watched it, I really enjoyed it, it's fairly long as well no,

no, god no, Jesus Christ,

Dan: We saved that for the main.

cris: no, but, yeah no, but it was, it was good, all the actors, there's, there's Christian Bale, I always liked it.

Amy Adams, she's definitely not pretty or not done up in this

Sidey: Yeah,

cris: looks a bit like just like a bland housewife. Sam Rockwell is really good and he's really funny.

Jesse Plemons or whatever. He's good that there's, you know, even what's his face? The 40 year old virgin. He's yeah, he's he's good as well.

And at the end when Cheney kind of says, oh, you need to go. We are getting fired from the Pentagon. He's like, I'm really sorry. He's like, No, you're not if I've taught you anything

Sidey: I wouldn't be if it

cris: because I wouldn't be if I was you so you're definitely not sorry It's fine. And he's like you think cow so so

For

me, it was a good movie and I don't know how soon I'm gonna watch it again But I'm not gonna be depressed.

It happened already is nothing I can do about it. It's just sad that people It happened and this, this kind of one guy controlled and, and maneuvered his way to do all this. But I think in politics, that's what everyone wants. So I'm not going to be too annoyed about it. It was good though. I enjoyed it.

Dan: and if you're really into it makeup and hairstyling got the

Sidey: Nice.

cris: Right. Okay.

Sidey: strong recommend.