Midweek Mention... Dead Man's Shoes

Dead Mans Shoes

Sidey: I did all the nominating this week and this film dead man's shoes is something that's cropped up in quite a few top fives recently. So I thought, given that I know at least one of you hadn't seen it, Pete, that I would nominate it. So here we are. Has everyone in the room seen this film now?

Reegs: Yes, yes,

Pete: I have to

Sidey: you all rewatch it for this?

Pete: Yes, yes. It's.

Dan: I rewatched it. For the first time I don't 10 years or something. I hadn't seen this film or where I belong.

Sidey: Yeah. Yeah. It was good while since I had seen it and I could remember the general gist of it, but not quite how fucking brutal it actually was. So it's the story of Richard played by Patty Constantine, who we get some flashback footage of him in his youth, with his brother and the family, some old sort of grainy, super eight footage in disperse with him walking to this. Disused kind of derelict farm building with his brother. And so should we just go straight for the, the spoil, if anyone hasn't seen this, we are going to completely spoil it. Cause it does have. A real kick over and end this one.

Pete: Is it?

Reegs: Okay. Do you want to go straight to that now

Dan: Well, for me, because I forgotten to the point where I'd seen it that long,

Sidey: this bit,

Dan: I knew there was a twist on it, but it was that long since I'd seen it.

And I remembered as I was going through the film. R Y okay. But I. When I turned this on and started watching it, it was like watching it for the first time.

Sidey: Well, they did, they tease it out and you get flashbacks of his brother with this drug gang and they are bullying him relentlessly and teasing him and just making his life misery.

He is, I think autistic. Yeah.

Reegs: Sorry. No, I

Pete: Yeah. The learning difficulties.

Yeah.

Sidey: that was in the text that I researched. But anyway, he has some kind of difficulty and

Reegs: It's Toby Kebbell and it's a fantastic performance somebody, cause it's not a patronizing over the top, you know, it's a difficult role to play and he plays it really well.

And what's more astonishing. And I found this out today is he was basically given the role one day before filming

Pete: begins.

Reegs: So it's, it's a really, yeah.

Pete: so I w I watched it, I recognized him. I haven't actually, is it rock and roller?

Reegs: Yeah. Yeah.

Pete: And I've seen him, I think in some, some other stuff.

Reegs: One of the planet of the apes movie.

He was in the fantastic four

Sidey: Well, both, both him and Patty constantly have played the same guy from factory records, one in control and pay to constant,

Pete: and for our party people. Yep. Okay. So, so on, on his performance, I'd seen that actor before, and I can't remember what it is. I've seen him in, I've seen bits of rock and roll. I've never actually seen the whole film. There's something that I'd seen him in. Bart's he, oh, no, it's a, the, the guy black mirror guy.

He's in an episode of black mirror. Yeah. Yeah. He's the actor is in an episode of black mirror. But my messages. We watched this with me again for the first time. Same as me, she asked. Oh, is, is that, does that actor have learning difficulties is bigger. Like that's sort of, kind of how convincing it is.

Reegs: Yeah. And he is giving quite a physical performance as well. He's not downplaying the disabilities that someone in that position might have. So well, I have to say

Dan: trivially understated as well. It did all it, it needed to, to get

Pete: across because we'll see

Dan: what happens is, is we've got the Patty Constantine's character you know how I mean he he's going back because he's from the army and he finds out that his brother's been terrifically

Sidey: It is. Yeah. It's, it's definitely set up as a revenge plot. That is pretty clear right from the get go. But because of the interactions, his brother's always with him, he speaks to him. You get flashbacks of the bullying.

You don't know exactly to what extent? Why is he quite so. So going for these guys, you know, other than the fact that they're horrible fucking drug dealers,

Reegs: pure rage from the second T's

Sidey: the very first interaction he has with anyone is in that cafe. Yeah. I think it is. And he sat in the corner with us. Yeah.

I didn't know it was a working man's cup and the guy just comes in and brazenly dating drugs at the pool table. He just fucking stares at him with his brother there. And I think his brother says that that's one of

Pete: Yeah. And then kind of looks away

Sidey: And he, yeah, he cowers in the case physically is like, Hi, Stover and caring and Patty constantly just fucking stared at this guy.

And the guy sort of clocked him a couple of times, carries on doing his thing. And then he says, what the fuck you say?

Pete: what the fuck are you looking at? And he just comes back with it.

Sidey: you can't

Pete: Yeah.

Sidey: and it's fucking terrifying opening into this guy, psych it. He is a fucking maniac.

Dan: this, now it begins doesn't it, it begins with this. And this guy has no idea of the absolute tidal wave of pain that is heading his way. And the, the. And until you watch all the film and it's one of those straightaway, you would go.

Odd need to watch this back again, you know, just to

Sidey: Is there anything that gives

Dan: anything that gives it away and to get the full wage, because I didn't, you know, from the beginning I was thinking, oh, well, you know, something's going to happen. He's going to beat him up. Or, you know, he's clearly not happy. It's only when you realize why he is, as you think these fuckers never had a chance.

They never had a chance. So the rage of this guy of what has happened,

Sidey: Well, you've, you've got the, the main guy of the gang, Sonny, the rest of them are kind of idiots, just sort of. Yeah, you can make

Dan: soldiers,

Reegs: small time, crim crims thugs in a small time. Provincial English town. I mean, it's

Dan: really big, brave, brave, and hard when there's weak fight in

Sidey: around

Dan: but, and anywhere anyone else, and they will crumble.

Reegs: They're bored, they're unemployed, they've got drugs and not a lot else.

Pete: Mean, even in that, they're sort of that they are meant to be kind of pathetic characters. And obviously they, they, you know, that they fucking horrible to Antony the brother and some to obviously a more significant extent than others. There's obviously like physical and sexual abuse going on, where, where Sony is concerned.

It's, it's hinted at as opposed to actually. You don't sort of see anything like definitely concrete happened, but there's the bit where he's like, oh, you know, you can suck my Dick or get the, get the special prize. And the special prize is just a punch in the head. But the re the reason why it was almost like laughable sort of characters, because

Reegs: well, they are silly.

They turn up in that fucking two CV.

Pete: that's exactly what

Reegs: what I mean? And you're like, oh, they like

Pete: the bit where the bit where he sort of, you know, he shoots his own guy.

Sidey: Yeah.

Pete: And then they're kind of like, they're all rattled. And I just looked at it like that scene and it's like, it's, it's, it's chilling. It's horrifying. It's it's tragic, but it's, it's also quite funny.

And then they're like pulling then pulling away all serious and obviously totally shell shock in like a shitty two CV.

Sidey: I didn't know whether that was because. It was just appropriate for the town that I ran,

Pete: it. That's it. That's why I think it's

Sidey: money to make this film to get back.

Pete: I think they probably could have had the means to get a better, you can get like pretty decent secondhand cars in the UK.

Like, so I think

Reegs: it was

Pete: again, it's it? Yeah. It's, it's exactly to make them look like. They think that they are a big deal in their town and they probably are a big deal in that town, but they all kind of LA you can, you know, they're pathetic characters as well. Cause

Reegs: He's not Richard Petty constantly in this sort of rage fueled revenge monster.

He's not John Rambo, even though it's clear that he's like, Stupidly well-trained and you know, he's an ex paratrooper,

Pete: but yeah.

Reegs: It's kind of showing here's what, like one competent well-trained individual can do against like a gang of absolute dipshits. They're not trying to say, oh, he's like, you know, he's got the St George's cross and you know, he's not the, the top

Sidey: even it's

Pete: really well done and an understated because obviously the, the training and everything comes into play. But you don't, you don't see it because it's the way he infiltrates all of their, their houses, their lives, you know, with writing things on the wall, painting their faces while they're asleep

Sidey: happens there because overall this film is. Not terrifying, but it's, it's a portrait of a man who is so filled with rage and he will stop at nothing to get this guys. But before he starts seriously, I think auntie there's a few moments of levity where first of all, he breaks into the apartment and there's a reason why he does it, but he also.

He spray paints them. He, you know, one of them gets a clown haircut. One, one, he sprays knob on the back of his jacket. He just clown

Pete: use wearing that jacket.

Reegs: Yeah,

Sidey: that was funny that they didn't change out of it. The Sani, he actually does clown face on him. But he steals all the gear.

Pete: Yeah,

Sidey: I thought was just something just to annoy them at first, but it plays is part of the plan later on.

Dan: w and one of the things as well, because as you, as you pointed out, Patty Constantine, Constantine, constant, constant Patty, he's actually a much smaller stature than, than Sonny when they square off at

the

Pete: Oh yeah. Yeah, absolutely. That, that scene in particular,

Dan: and he's totally not

Pete: that scene in particular because it's, it kind of reminds. So like we, we all grow up in Jersey and light. So some extent we would have all encountered, like, you know, when you were younger pre predominantly like some kind of confrontation, there'd be like kids who you don't know or you heard about, or that they like.

Enemies of other children and stuff. And so that, that happens. And every now and again, that would happen in, in life. Well, certainly in my youth where there'd be like a large Allah or there's that deck, like, you know, and, and then if they stood up to you, when you, you know, just like, oh, what were you doing the other night?

And they said like, still up here, it was kind of like, okay, well, there might be a little bit more to this person than you think in this light. And you know, these are fully grown adults, the bit where the TCV is driving along the road, they see him stood by the side of the road. And Sony gets out to you know, just to come and like flex his muscles and try and intimidate.

Yeah. Like to try and intimidate.

Sidey: guys

Dan: the car will thinking they're getting chin

Pete: Exactly. I think, I think there's four at that

Dan: battery here.

Pete: And when he just says yeah, so what I've heard it and he goes, yeah, it was me straight away. And you, you. Well, I mentioned this in, in a previous, in a previous pod. Okay. And it's so much so straight away, you know, like, fuck

Sidey: not scared of me. I, yeah,

Pete: exactly.

Yeah.

Sidey: Yeah. I mean, he just holds out his hand Palm up and it points, he goes, you're right.

Fucking there. And he's fucking

Reegs: but it is fearlessness that is. Verging on suicidal, the more it

Pete: completely he doesn't care.

Reegs: he gets himself into dangerous positions that even somebody, even though he's like completely outwitting them, he's better trained and prepared

Dan: backed up himself with training all this, you know, he's not just saying it, hoping that the guy's gonna call his bluff and whatever, or he's not going to call his bluff, but he's. You know, he's prepared for everything he wants this and you're right. There is

Pete: I

Dan: don't give a

Pete: fuck. Yeah. For me, I thought, I think so, you know, then watching the film and how it plays out and everything that happens.

And then obviously like the big reveal, but also right at the very end it's like what, what Patty Constantinople says with about, you know, when he does say, yeah, he was a fucking embarrassment, like, you know, he like talks about it, disparagingly about his own brother. And, and it kind of alludes to the fact that he himself was embarrassed about his brother in previous years before we went off.

Sidey: there. Guilt of being away. He

Pete: So, and then all of this has happened. He's heard how it's probably the, the tragedy of the story and of what's happened to his brother and how frightened and scared he was in order to eventually the big spoil take his own life. At that point, And then you think back through, through the rest of the film, he's a trained killer.

He's obviously not going to be intimidated by like small town decades that have done so, but he doesn't care whether he lives or dies. And I think his intention all the way through is to. He wants it to, to be his end. Like he's going to go out sort of

Sidey: explicitly

Pete: try and yeah. Try and wrong. Sorry, try and right. The wrongs of his own life, as well as everything that happened to his brother

Dan: with his own life and chooses

Pete: No, exactly. Yeah.

Dan: The

Sidey: Aeration

Reegs: at the beginning. As they're walking over the Moore's the brothers, he says, God will forgive them. He'll forgive them and allow them into heaven.

I can't live with that. And that's, that's his motivation right there. He wants to end this, but also. And it plays into what's happened, what will happen at right. The very end of the movie, which we might as well talk about now. Yeah.

Dan: yeah,

Sidey: Yeah.

Reegs: He. Also knows that he has become a monster as he's tracked these guys down and it, and it does escalate.

There's the scene that we've talked about a number of times on the podcast where he appears wearing a gas mask. It's just really very frightening. There's the scene.

Sidey: hammer,

Reegs: He's quite happy.

Sidey: going to hammer

Dan: I, I say it is, it is fine, but there was part of me that had a kind of curl of laughter, ready to happen a lot of the way through this film, because it is filled with dark humor.

Sidey: first interactions, you know, when you spray paints the clown face and all that, that's funny, you know, and then it, yeah.

It escalates very quickly. Cause then

Dan: not

Reegs: funny when he's lacing a kettle full of

Sidey: even before that, the first guy that goes is a hammer beating to death. They're having a meeting in the pub upstairs. One of them goes up for a piss and finds the dead body and it's

Pete: I think it's an ax. Yeah. He's. Yeah, because, because you see later on like him flashing back to the thing and he's walking towards the guy with, with an ax

Reegs: Yeah.

Dan: and yeah. And at that point though, I was still, you know, because the first half of the movie, it had little laughs and things like that.

And you were still cut. Is that just happened? It's

Sidey: here's here's the psychotic killer that you're rooting for? I think it's the only film I can

Reegs: Well, it's like watching a Halloween movie or Jason Vorhees, you know, Friday the 13th, something like that, but rooting for the S the main psycho

Dan: it more value in like Taken what's the guy in that Liam Newton, where it had that kind of

Pete: Leslie's brother.

Reegs: Leslie.

Dan: Where he's said, yeah, just fill in your own names in and around that if you can blank and bleep it out later then I found it was, it reminded me of that a little bit as far as revenge.

And you were rooting for that person who's gone on doing loads of damage.

Pete: Yeah. I mean, I th I don't know if you'll speak. I know you said that you'd kind of forgotten the film, but you must have known that like the big things in the film, like what it was about you must've known that the brother was ultimately dead.

And so unlike for me watching this the first time, I did laugh at like, you know, knob on the back of his jacket. Cause it's just such a fight. Like this is a trained killer and he's trying to scare the shit out of him, but it's not, it's not written like, you know, I dunno what it was. Is it Cheyenne, Cheyenne Stokes or something he'd written on the wall.

Sidey: it's about the

Reegs: of breath that you go into. It's a play on the, I didn't look it up the real term, but I think it's a homonym for Shane stoking. It's the type of breathing pattern you go in just before you.

Sidey: die.

Pete: Okay. So that's like a threat, whereas like knob and like like a sort of multicolored circle on the back of the jacket.

I did, I chuckled in LA, but it was, it was almost like nervous. Laughter. I knew this was building up to something. I was terrified all the way through, but not in a. Not in like, but in a couldn't take my eyes off. It kind of weighed, normally say with like a horror or something, I'll be scared. And I don't want to watch, I do not want to watch it.

And I was apprehensive about watching this film. The reason why I'd avoided it is because a mutual friend of ours had said, this is fucking like terrifying. It is so, so chilling. And I, and that's why I stayed away from, I thought I don't really need to watch stuff that makes me want to shit. My pants.

Well,

Sidey: it's not like that

Pete: it's, it's not, it's not like that. It's compelling. You can't take your eyes off it. His performance is. Fucking unbelievable. It's chilling. It is absolutely chilling how, and the things it's is so SIM so simple, he doesn't use big threats and  monologues about what he's going to do to them and everything like that. It's, it's almost like.

Reegs: he escalates the scene really quickly. And then it makes him always in control because people are like trying to threaten him and immediately he's taken it way beyond what they're prepared for and then solving challenges.

He's always got the power of the,

Pete: Yeah. Because there's, there's an interesting scene where they. Where they're talking about what they're going to do. And basically the plan is to, well, you're going to have to like tease them out with some money and I'm gonna have to shoot them. And they've all gone.

Like, oh fuck, no, we can't do this. And a couple of guys like, oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. W w we'll back you and stuff. So that, that doesn't come naturally to them. This is a guy who was ready to shoot anyone right in the face at any point.

Sidey: You can say the juxtaposition of he is a trained guy. He's got a plan. He knows exactly what to do when the shit hits the fan for them, they've got like a samurai

Pete: sword.

Sidey: and

Reegs: got a bullet. There's a gun. That's only got one bullet or

Pete: something.

Reegs: It's really weird. Yeah.

Sidey: So they are there. They've obviously never been challenged.

No one's ever stood up to them before they, they just fucking, haven't got a clue. They decided to basically say, we've got the first guy who's dead. Yeah. They kind of do a runner. But that the, especially the three sort of goons, they are panicking because they're just like, he's going to find us what we're going to do.

He like, he's going to kill us

Dan: th they shit themselves at both that level and the level of Sonny where, you know, if

Sidey: they

Dan: anything wrong, then Sunny's going to beat the shit out of him. Suddenly they realize that guy, Santa Claus,

Reegs: competitor

Dan: the guy that got on our tail now.

Sidey: but

Reegs: So the power structure in the gang starts to crumble a

Pete: little. So even before the stuff starts to happen, when I think it's Herbie, is it the guy's name?

Yeah, the first guy that has the, the first interaction. Yeah. He goes back and then he says in the flat in Sonny's flat and it, or eventually when he realizes who it is, he was like, yeah.

Reegs: And,

Pete: But when he realizes who it is, he goes, oh, I think it's Richard, like Anthony's brother and straight away the face everybody's looking around going, are you sure that he can't, they,

Dan: like that legend that went off to the army and he was like, trying to kill her. And you never thought you'd

Pete: hear.

Dan: him again and you go what? He's back and remember that shit. We did his brother

Pete: Yeah, exactly, exactly. That they now know that they're in for a fucking Torrid time.

Sidey: So one guy just does a runner. Yeah. And I fucking grip,

Pete: But

Sidey: he's not sort of seeing for a little while. Eventually the thing with the drugs game missing comes back because he puts it in the cattle. So when they sit down to have a cup of tea, they are. Like away with the fairies completely

Pete: in Spangler dash. Yeah.

Sidey: And so he comes in and it really, really starts to kick off now because they haven't got a clue what's going on. And I really thought Sonny would be the last kill. But not a bit, a

Pete: Just over so quickly,

Sidey: bag over the head

Dan: taken any, but clearly he had, cause you'd never saw him drinking his tea. His was just at the side

Sidey: you can see the effects.

Reegs: Yeah. But you did see him without his shirt on like

Sidey: I was doing weights. It wasn't me.

Dan: Well, this is what I really loved about the way this film was shot.

Cause it's quite clearly on a budget. You know

Pete: what? You didn't

Dan: have

a ton of money to, to shoot this, I think. But you wouldn't know from the, the humor and the way he's able to squeeze all the value out of the shots

that

Pete: writing and the acting absolutely like top drawer.

Yeah.

Dan: I, I heard you say before that Shane Meadows and Paddy constant and I tended to know Paul

Pete: even say that,

Dan: is, is good mates.

And you can see that they would have, you know, work together and to, to develop the camp.

Reegs: Constantine's got a writing

Sidey: written there.

Reegs: Yeah.

Dan: Okay. Then again, it. It's kinda cements the, the tightness of both acting and script. I think

that they just, and direction

they just hit it off. I mean, it was absolutely fantastic. Yeah. They got all the, they hit all the notes. I think for me on this film, when they went for fear, they hit fear when they went for humor, they got

Sidey: here.

Dan: And when they, they went for anything else in between with any of the characters that you actually start delight her, be a little bit, you thought he wasn't too

Pete: I saw, I thought he was gonna get away. I thought he was gonna get away.

Dan: them might get away. Spoiler, no,

Sidey: Well, yeah, so sunny, sunny is basically taken into room plastic bag over the head and just fucking executed there. And then, and that really surprised me. Cause I thought that might be a longer drawn out thing. Then he talks to

Reegs: Alan,

Sidey: How does he get out? And I can't remember.

Pete: Oh no, it's the, the Palm Palm nose through the, yeah, the nose bone through the brain.

Reegs: get

Dan: or is that another Allen

Reegs: it's Herbie. You get stopped. Isn't it?

Pete: I

Sidey: But he, he shows them a suitcase

Pete: Yeah.

Sidey: and I just didn't see this covenant. So yeah. Yeah, this is what I had forgotten from the first time I'd seen it. I completely, this had gone and he says, oh, come on. He sort of befriends him. He sort of convinced him that everything's going to be okay, but, but you've got to open the suitcase.

You've got to open the suitcase and see what's inside. And it's the guy who's done a runner or crumpled up in a suitcase,

Dan: face light

Sidey: face,

Pete: contorted. Yeah.

Sidey: the tarmac, but

Dan: bear in mind previous to this probably an hour or two before he's given him the highest dose of, of like psychedelic drugs

Pete: than

Dan: any. Human has ever taken. They put it all in the cat or my tower of like what they would have probably sold for thousands of

Pete: pounds in the street.

Dan: And they've had this all one

Reegs: not next

Dan: to them. So then to open a, a suitcase with a body in your offer, a battery

Reegs: Yeah,

Pete: then this, this was the first time. Patty confetti Considine, Considine, or Constadine okay. His character eludes to cause what he says to Herbie, because Herbie likes starts slight blobbing when he sees his mate in, in the suitcase as you would do.

And he says, I, I, I, it's not nice to lose someone is there. And at that point, obviously there hadn't been the reveal of the brother. So I was thinking. We'll see, is he talking about like in the army? I thought he was going to say like, you know, lost people in the army, whatever we didn't know about the parents or because he, that that's clearly what he says.

And it was only when we found out that the brother had killed himself. That that made sense to

Sidey: then he gets Herbie, Herbie had a knife he's in no fit state to use it anymore.

And he says, oh, is this for me? We can use that on me when I need it. But he's like kidding on that. You know, that he's going to be all

Pete: Do you think he was gonna let him go?

Sidey: I thought it was,

Pete: I thought he was gonna let him go.

Cause I think because he starts being Pally with her, but almost like, Herbie's just like, he's like a minion. He wasn't wanting

Sidey: maybe now that Sonny's gone.

Pete: Yeah.

Sidey: You know, it doesn't really matter about this guy. He's so like, yeah.

Reegs: He looked like the guy out of two pints of lager in a packet of

Pete: He did a bit. Yeah, I know who you mean.

Yeah. Well, something

Sidey: he is stabbed and killed. So that is effectively the gang gone, but there's one guy who's managed to sort of get out of this and start a new life.

He's married and has two children, which were played by petty. Constantine's nephews. They come back to the park with the gas mask and

Pete: and a knife. Yeah.

Sidey: Which is fairly chilling.

Pete: really, really fucking sinister because I did, I did wonder I was the second to be like, I didn't know how this was going to play out, because again, you think, well, what's this guy done.

If, if he's the one that they're looking for. Yeah. Yeah.

Sidey: flashback scene and it is fucking awful.

Dan: Well, they, this, this has got the attention because what he does is he meets the, the last gang members, kids in the park gives them these kind of inappropriate gifts

Sidey: There's a couple of very quick

Dan: back to mum who obviously on dad's Casey and go, what the fuck's going

Pete: She, she's another show Meadows sort of frequent collaborator. She's the mum in? This is England.

Sidey: there's. Yeah, there's a couple of quick cuts to him in the park with the kids. And he's like showing like stabbing motions of what to do in life. Not fucking hell, but he, He then visits the house. And he just says, I'll just tell him I was looking for him. It's it's Anthony's brother. So when he gets back, she says, oh, and you get the same reaction of this chill. Oh shit. Like, ah, didn't want

Pete: what I

Dan: right about this guy is that instantly told open to the misses. He

Pete: completes the story.

Sidey: he knows what's up.

Dan: this is a guide that has no, not only knows what's up is repented and wanting to put all that behind him, wanting to say to the messages.

We did some crazy shit. LA I've got to go and fucking sort this out with him or whatever, but he obviously doesn't get that opportunity to say it to the masses because he gets

Pete: kidnapped, kidnapped by

Dan: from home and taken to the bond where it all starts because it opens up with. Patty Constantinople on the on these pallet boards

Pete: Oh, so that was the, I didn't know it was S so that's the place that he'd been staying and yeah,

Dan: out for that these days, actually, it's one of the first scenes I look at a film is where it opens up because a lot of they circle back to the end and you know, where it ends is where it starts and things. And that was the case in, in this movie where he goes back to the barn where his brother.

Eventually hung

himself

after the torture and the terrible behavior

Reegs: by his

Dan: friends in this other gang

Sidey: that's that flashback scene of the suicide and the buildup to it is really, really harrowing.

Reegs: it is.

Dan: but

Reegs: It's a part of the

Pete: You're okay with it.

Reegs: know it's part of the film that plot-wise, doesn't quite add up for me, like, oh, he's just left alone. So he gets, you know, and he's really high. And then he just hangs himself. I dunno. Maybe, maybe not. Yeah. Anyway, it's not really was given

Dan: all kinds of fucking drugs as

Reegs: well.

Dan: Wasn't it? He was given all kinds of psychedelic drugs, which would be harmful, you know, for anybody in that kind of environment. When you've got a load of when you've got a load of people all on top of you, shouting at you and all the way

Pete: at this point, , let's stay on, like you said, and put like a tab of acid on his on his tongue and then that given him more. So, I mean, there's, this is somebody who is like cognitively, isn't probably as capable as other people and now is like completely fucked on acid, but I think that it was, it was believable as to this is the climax of what eventually made this, this poor lad kill him,

Sidey: but it doesn't go down quite certainly not as I was expecting here because he actually passes the knife over.

Yeah, Patty constantly passes the knife over and he actually, he says that you mentioned it before about how his brother was an embarrassment and he sort of impersonates them and it's quite grim, but I think he's got all these now. He's sort of. He's

Pete: I think by this time. Yeah, he's lost his mind though.

Sidey: he's lost it, but he's got all those feelings of guilt, I assume, from being away and not being able to have his brother.

And he, and he actually says about, was that I just, I just want to lie with my

Pete: body, which

Dan: is what he's spilling out.

Then as he's got this kidnap, this guy, taking him to the bond where his brother had hung himself, and this guy thinks well I'm next year, because he's already said that I've killed all that lot. They used to be with. And the only way you're getting out of here is if I'm dead, this is the only way that it's ended.

And he can't believe what I'm dead or. No PA party

Reegs: well, I think part of it is, yeah, I was going to say there's like, because there is quoting from the Bible all the way through this movie. And if there is like some sort of Christian message behind it then, and he is quoting.

You know the Bible, right? The first opening lines of the, or not the Bible, but he's talking about God and the Christian, God, he knows then that he's as guilty as anybody else. And so he has to pay for his crime. So that's what he has to get the guy to fix.

Pete: him off. Yeah. Yeah. I still, I, I still sort of wondered after, because this is a very, very thought provoking film.

I can tell you, I've watched it in a, an evening. 10 11 o'clock the next day, I still had a bit of a feeling of anxiety about me. That's how jarring the, the, the, you know, chilling the performance and the, you know, the subject matter of the film, like worth to me. But I did wonder whether or not with that final kind of light.

Sort of chapter whether or not he knew that the other guy, I think he kind of knew that this guy probably wasn't as complicit as others in the, in the tormenting of his brother and the guy admits, he goes, cause he says, what did you do? And he said, I just didn't stop them. That was, I, he goes, basically say I didn't join in, but I didn't stop them.

I should have. And I could have, but I didn't. And he says pretty much the same to his wife when he's spilling the beans. So I, again, I don't know whether. Parties, you know what's it, Rick

Reegs: um,

Pete: whether he, that was his plan all along to get this guy to kill him or whether he was going to kill this guy. And then whilst he was stood there, he was, I'm sick of this.

Now I feel like I've got my revenge and I know I've become a monster, so I just want you to end me, but

Sidey: at one point, I wondered if he was going to end up hanging himself,

Pete: Okay. Which, yeah.

Sidey: the fuck was going on

Reegs: Cheeky, little Wang, first

Sidey: Yeah, it was David Carradine. Yeah. Yeah. So that is it. And he has died and the other guy. Sort of stumbles out of there covered in blood and with this has to live with this for the rest of his days. Yeah. So you mentioned it Pete, but the performance from Patty Constantine for me is fucking all time.

Great. It's so fucking good.

Dan: that scene, if you're unsure about whether to watch this film and not check out the scene on YouTube, where he stands and stares down sunny, After he gets out this car and he's talking about him being in the

Sidey: he's really good at it, that guy as well.

Pete: Yeah. Yeah.

Dan: But that scene there, we'll just tell you all you need to know about this character and the way this film's going, because this is a guy who psychologically has all these guys just in an, in his hand.

And he will crush them when he wants.

Sidey: You mentioned it before we, but you know, phew. If he put the mask on him, you know, it could be Michael Myers or it could be Jason Vorhees. This is effectively a slasher film, but you know,

Pete: But it does so much more with it. Like I, I'm not, you know, guys with Masa that, you know, there's, there's Jason, there's the Halloween guy like that. They're the ones who just mentioned, I think, but you know, and then there's 13 iterations of them and 15 and softeners, so boring.

So been done before what he's going to want to chase some more people around until men them, but with no. Real depth to the character that I'm aware of. Anyway, this does so, so much more in some ways it's scary. It is much scarier. I've seen Friday the 13 films and you know exactly what's going to happen with this.

You didn't fuck it. I didn't know. I didn't know how bad the executions were going to get. I didn't know what was going to happen next. I fucking couple of times I was like in the film and I had to just like, have a look around my room to make sure I was still the I wasn't a threat

Reegs: Well, if the threat of violence earlier on is almost as bad as when it's actually on leash You guys I know are huge fans of combat jackets. he wears the M 1 9 6 5 combat jacket,

Pete: I thought it was yeah.

Reegs: one that Travis Bickle wears in

Pete: nice. Nice.

Reegs: So it's obviously the gas

Sidey: mask stat? Yeah. It's a cold war era, Russian GP five without the filter,

Reegs: without the filter.

Sidey: have the

filter.

Dan: Yeah. I was wondering if he throws anything down, what would fit without,

Sidey: The budget for this 723 pounds,

Reegs: 723 pounds

Sidey: With three zeros on the end. So thousands, so not, not quite a million. So not a huge budget, but you think it made money or lost

Dan: I it's one of those films, it doesn't really matter. Do you know what

Pete: mean?

Sidey: that doesn't answer the question, Dan.

Dan: I would say that it's made

Pete: money.

Sidey: Yeah.

Reegs: So

Dan: I would say that it's made money. It's

Pete: not, don't expect huge returns. I can't see this. I don't even know if it was a cinematic release.

It

Reegs: cinematic release in the UK. I reckon you could cut together a trailer for a foreign audience that people would go, oh, watch that.

That looks interesting. So yeah, it's going to be a hit.

Sidey: 200,000 us. I'm afraid.

All I can think is that some of it, obviously you can make a trailer look good, but some of the, some of the scenes that don't have Patti constantly. So when it's just the guys in their flat talking, it's very

Pete: low budget.

Sidey: Well, but it's very provincial sort of accents

Reegs: for

Sidey: would be a hard sell to get this scene overseas.

Pete: Must be. I mean, I know that there's a cult following for this because straight. So after I saw this film, I went into work the next day. And I just started saying to people, have you seen this film?

Have you seen this? And I did it again all over the weekend when I was at football. And so, and every single person who'd seen it, their reaction was exactly the same going like, oh my God. Yeah. And it was almost like they were back to that place that I was at feeling fucking terrified and anxious, but also in total, all of.

PR predominantly the performance. Yeah. But also the, you know, the, the, you know, the script, the idea and, and everything.

Sidey: Well, it's done well in Jersey then, but perhaps not so well everywhere

Pete: Yeah. Strange.

Sidey: I love it. I think it's great.

Pete: absolutely the same. Yep.

Dan: Yeah. When I, for me,

Reegs: Watch it